BIG BASS from a compact speaker. Down to 18hz.

Jorge

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the keyword there "in the price range", and the reference to RVWilliams Symphony Antarctica... Hi-end for the folks on the budget (and $1k for the minis is where we are) is all about compromises: my stereo of a die-hard flat-earther gives me the thrills of PRAT but no imaging (as we say, who cares where they sit, we are here for the tune!) and no gut-wrenching impact of similarly-priced floorstanders. These reviews, IMHO, do not do them justice by trying too hard to sell "designer's/lifestyle" product to those who care about music, not the looks or convenience
 

Radio raheem

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May 13, 2009
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i think jorge has hit the nail on the head, it's aimed at those wanting better than wave radio.....i saw some speakers on ebay that could truly do what this claims and they cost 42 thousand pounds second hand, now that i can belive
 

panabox1

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Mar 17, 2010
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Jorge said:
the keyword there "in the price range", and the reference to RVWilliams Symphony Antarctica... Hi-end for the folks on the budget (and $1k for the minis is where we are) is all about compromises: my stereo of a die-hard flat-earther gives me the thrills of PRAT but no imaging (as we say, who cares where they sit, we are here for the tune!) and no gut-wrenching impact of similarly-priced floorstanders. These reviews, IMHO, do not do them justice by trying too hard to sell "designer's/lifestyle" product to those who care about music, not the looks or convenience
FYI “in the price range” in that article is the price of the phantom gold which is $3000.
 

DrmZ

Member (SA)
Reli said:
Frequency response data is useless unless it includes the decible dropoff. There's no way it can play 18 Hz as loudly as it can play 1,000 Hz, for example.
This!
Its the reason bass players have bigger speaker cabinets compared to guitar players.
For lower frequencies you need way more power and membran area to match the volume of instruments in higher frequencies.
I does not matter that much how big a single speaker is.
The Ampeg SVT810 aka the fridge has been a popular speaker cabinet on stage for decades because eight 10 inch speakers make a lot of bass.
They can move about the same ammount of air like four 15 inch speakers

Also a 18hz wave is really long with a wave length of 19 meters or 62 feet.
Not something for your typical living room.
 

Reli

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Jorge said:
Looks like an evident upgrade path for Bose WaveRadio owners... Oops, no such creatures here or at Audiogon community :-)
I side with Superduper, it is a nice addition to the trashcan!
Bose Wave was overpriced for what it was.....Same with most Bose products, including the 901......They used very cheap speakers inside, so the only way they achieved decent sound was due to bass tubes and fancy EQ circuitry. In fact as I recall, you had to buy a standalone EQ from Bose to get the most out of them.
 

Superduper

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@Reli, why do you say that the 901's were junk? It's true that they require a dedicated EQ in order to perform properly but it is an active equalizer and specifically designed to get the most out of the driver system. Yes, while it is a bit more inconvenient to require an additional piece of gear, the speakers are designed as a "speaker-system" which includes the equalizer so any reviews need to include that equalizer in order to review the "system" and not just a component of a system. I've read the reviews and while there are some reviews that trash the Bose 901's, there are many more that rates them well. In fact, most reviews (including Amazon from 901 customers) are mostly favorable. They might produce more volume than my Polk SDA SRS 1.2 (not sure, I didn't test and my ears can't handle sound that loud but I doubt they will) but then they are only priced at 1/2 in 2016 of what the Polks costed in 1995. So they are sold to the mass market and not audiophiles who wouldn't mind plunking down $10,000 ~ $20,000 for a pair of speakers. I do have a brand new pair of 901 series VI in special black that I acquired in a "lot" purchase about 15 years ago. I basically made the purchase for the lot of Carver equipment and the speakers came with the system. Since I never used mine and therefore can't testify about the sound, I'm merely going by what I've read and again, the reviews are mostly favorable, might boil down to individual ears and preferences. What is true however, is that Bose belongs to either love it or hate it crowds but if the reviews are to be believed, it's mostly love it and for the price, should be a very good value. As for the Wave Radios, what I can tell you is that the Bose Wave Radio service manual is one of the more highly requested SM's in the AA collection, so is a pretty clear indication to me that owners regard them highly enough to want to repair them when they need service. Most folks just toss all-in-one stuff when they fail as they are deemed not worth the cost and effort of repair.

As for the internet, for almost any subject, there's always conflicting and myth buster types of articles. For example, just google distilled water and for every website that claims it is good for you, there is an equal number claiming that distilled water will kill you. It's just PURE water for goodness sake, about as pure as you can get. My urologist once told me that the minerals (and lack of) in water is insignificant because we consume much more through our food intake than we ever get from the various flavors of water. But forget about water, just google virtually any food item from tea, coffee, salt, msg, and the # of conflicting reviews and articles abound from so called "experts."

Bottom line is the best reviews are from actual customers and owners. All the rest is just conjecture or bias due to conflict of interest (such as a supplement seller telling how great supplements are).
 

Reli

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Because I dislike companies that succeed not with quality but with hucksterism and cost-cutting. When you use 9 identical drivers, which you also recycled in other models like the 802, that seems like a cost-cutting move to me. If it was such a great idea to use several mid-size drivers, with no tweeter or large bass driver, why didn't most other manufacturers do it?

They may be loud as hell, but does the bass hold up at high volume? Could you do justice to an action movie soundtrack without adding a subwoofer? I kinda doubt it. But hey, each person's tastes and music preferences are different, so if they like 'em, fine.

Funny thing, the stands they sold with them didn't even have slots for the wires. So basically you're smashing the wire, making the stand slightly unbalanced.

The reason lots of Bose Waves are still around is because the average owner was older (they sold for $400+) and they just let it sit on a shelf instead of carrying it around outside. So they never got beat up. Also they aggressively marketed them through subcontractors, I actually interviewed with one in the early 90's and they were using deceptive sales techniques to convince people that it could actually replace a full home system. Do they sound good for a small all-in-one device? Hell yes...….but did the actual engineering inside justify the price? Nah. The only thing sophisticated thing about them was the housing with its fancy internal ducts.
 

Superduper

Member (SA)
But why would anyone take the wave radio outside? It’s not a Boombox, it’s a table radio. Also, until you’ve personally heard speakers with multiple identical smaller drivers, you might want to reserve judgement until you do. Up until I heard my Polk speakers (which has 8 6.5” drivers), I never expected much bass but man, does it hit hard, in fact much harder and deeper than any 15”, 16” or 18” woofers do (that I’ve heard) in a normal stereo system, and for which these speakers are intended for. You asked if they can get loud without distorting, but I’ll welcome you to visit someday when you are nearby for a listen. I honestly think that even as critical as you are, that you’ll be thoroughly impressed, and your only complaint might be in size. I believe you’ll find that your eardrums will blow out well before the 6.5” drivers distort. I can’t feed them more than about 40w of the 250w available on the adcom amp that’s pushing them before the volume exceeds my comfort level and the speakers are rated to handle some impossible 1000 watts or something like that.

As for action movie soundtrack, come on now, that’s like complaining that a pickup truck doesn’t fit in a garage, or a Prius won’t hold a sheet of plywood, or a dodge demon doesn’t get good fuel economy when going 180 mph. Action movies, or cinema in general should be powered via a home theater audio system which includes, yes, a subwoofer. But when listening to actual music, guess what, home theater systems typically sound like crap. The speaker systems aside from subwoofers are usually comprised of, yep, tons of small drivers spaced all over the room, usually with no tweeters. Music sounds anything but colorful and dynamic, but voices and scores sound great and grenade blasts have that desirable butt tickling shake. But that being said, I believe my Polks might be able to pull it off anyhow. Well, maybe not the earthquake butt shaking rumble of a tank, but gunshots & explosions will certainly push your eardrums to their limits.

Anyhow all I’m saying is try it before bashing it. Bose is a tremendously successful $2B/yr company and regardless of how you feel about them, there’s no doubt that if they only peddle junk, nobody would buy from them again after initially getting taken. Instead, they have a following. Are there better products? Yes, there always is, for almost everything. Anyway, I don’t know about the door to door sales practice, you have personal knowledge on that so I’ll take your word for it but that’s the subcontractor trying to make a sale, not Bose, and you said yourself that they sound good and in the end, isn’t that what’s important? As to value, that’s up to the end user to decide. All the emails I get from owners wanting to restore their radios however tells me that the owners like them, a lot.

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Ok, I'm editing my post. I just now took a look at eBay and what the wave radio looks like. It's not what I had in mind, it's the Bose Acoustic Wave music system that gets more interest (although the wave radio too, to a lesser degree). I'm not going to defend the pricing, as the $499 price tag of the clock-radio looking thing does seem rather high and which I personally wouldn't pay. But $299 doesn't seem out of line for a good sounding piece of gear. Perhaps the extra $200 was the commission for the sales "contractor" to make it convenient for you to get one sold to you at your front door. But don't blame Bose though, it's almost a certainty that door to door sales people will have one with them when they pitch the sale and if the owner listened to it, on their counter, and paid the $499 for it, that's on them. As for the AWMS, it seems the MSRP is a whopping $2499 which again, is something seemingly outrageous. But you can get used ones for $200 and for that price, the reviews are mostly all good except for a few that expected more bass. Anyway, my initial post was in reference to the Bose 901's which priced at $1399 MSRP (you can get them cheaper) which in my opinion and that of many others, is reasonable and a good value.
 

Reli

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The Wave Radio was a smaller version....The Acoustic Wave was the original, taller and bigger unit. Regardless, they were all marketed towards affluent people who were either:

1) Clueless about audio (nothing wrong with that, nobody has the time to become knowledgeable about everything)
2) Wanted a clock radio that could double as a bedroom sound system
3) Or just didn't want to bother selecting and installing individual components.

If it worked for them, great......but let's not kid ourselves that Bose was actually interested in advancing the field of sound. They went their own way, ignoring what other companies had done, not because that was the best way, but because it resulted in something they could patent and brand as "unique" and "intelligent", so that people would think they were experts, justifying high prices and profit margins. Reminds me of Apple in a way......A company that exudes an elite, ivory tower like image, yet fails to provide features other companies introduced years ago, claiming that consumers don't care about those features, when it's really because they wanted to keep production costs low.

$2499? Never heard that price, that's insane. I remember the Acoustic Wave being about $1,200 ten years ago, but it depends on accessories like the power pack, the multi-CD changer, etc. Regardless, that's a huge profit margin, and $1200 could buy lots of things much better than that.
 

Superduper

Member (SA)
I stand corrected. After a little more research, looks like the msrp back in the day for the AWMS was around $1k or so. The $2499 was a listing I found for a single new unit, I guess they are selling them like NOS boomboxes with prices to match. But as you say, they were marketed to "affluent" folks which wasn't me, so I wouldn't/didn't purchase any of those things. Still, the folks that own them like them, but then again, they aren't the boombox crowd either and probably listen to classical more than ear busting bass stuff. For what they listen to, I'm sure it's great for them.

I would never call anyone "clueless" about audio though. People like what they like. I often see folks shaking their heads at the car next to them, the one with the vibrating trunk lid from compartment filled with battery depleting subs. And I concur. But hey, if they wanna burst their eardrums with systems and music like that, I'm ok with it, doesn't bother me a bit, but that music doesn't do it for ME personally though, I like and listen to other stuff. I'm sure each individual will think they know what's best for them. Who am I to tell them that what they listen to and what they perceive is good audio is not? After all, what IS good audio? Something that is capable to play at 10hz? Because when I said I don't care, I really meant it. The only time I wanna hear (or feel actually) 10hz is when I'm watching a movie to improve the experience, not that I think it sounds at all like music, which to me is something altogether entirely different. My brother in law plays for the Symphony and he only listens to classical stuff. I've never seen him listen to anything else which I find fascinating. But like I said, people like what they like and I'm sure for him, "good" audio system is one that is capable of reproducing all of the little detail and nuances in the music and instruments he listens to and is interested in, which doesn't include buzzing noises, so for him, booming bass is meaningless, since none of his music has it.
 

Ghettoboom767

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I have heard the Bose 901 V-Series soeakers connected to a Nakamichi Professional rack system with all individual componants and i’m very happy to say the sound was very very nice! Very accurate and these speakers are individually positioned for maximum acoustics from these enclosures. I remember there being stands for these speakers that they sat on.
Yes i’ve heard some very nice systems and i really enjoyed the 901’s super nice mids and extremely nice highs and if i remember and decent tight good sounding bass. Very good quality speakers that like Norm said i believe went for about $1,200 in 82’. Hooe this helps.😊😎🎶🎼📻