My TOSHIBA WX-1 Speaker upgrade

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Cpl-Chronic

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Hey box lovers & MOD freaks!!!

As you may know, I am always chomping at the bit to improve the sound of the small number of grails in my collection. I recently paid a hefty sum for a rare, WX-1 & had the entire slider board swapped out because of a bad Extended bass controller IC. Decent man for you sold it to me without a complete disclosure but overall, a decent unit. If CDn funds weren't so flat against the US dollar, it would have been easier to but you have to strike while the iron is hot or miss out....

The speakers & passives are in great shape & sounds very good. In fact Toshiba did a great job designing the speakers but I want to save the skins & keep them fresh so I decided to go with a dual woofer setup to replace the exisiting drivers & keep them wrapped in plastic to preserve their condition while pumping the jams through some modern cans....

Here's a pic of the proposed setup using some extremely good 6.5" sub-woofers that only require 0.16 cu ft sealed enclosures to reach 50Hz. These will be coupled with 2 4.5" Pioneer Woofers, both 4 OHMS in series to create an 8 OHM load to each amp channel.....

The real problem for this MOD is that the back wave from the larger woofer is interacting with the smaller 4.5" woofer & creating a nasty peak in the upper mid-bass region & muddy bass all over the place except the very bottom octave which sounds OK. This is predictable & no surprise during my initial listening tests. My experiment today is to create a sealed chamber around the 4.5" woofers, using a couple of round plastic food storage containers similar to a margarine tub...This will isolate the smaller woofer from the larger one while converting the 4.5" drivers into midbass/mid woofers & damping their bottom end response, passively, by air-loading.

To briefly explain, if you take a small woofer & create a sealed enclosure around the basket, with a small amount of air inside, it acts to dampen the lower frequencies & increasing impedance in the lower octaves by pneumatic resistance instead of using a crossover to change electrical resistance/inductance...

Pics coming soon.....
 

JVC Floyd

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You know it might sound stupid but what about just building a custom speaker box that mounts to the main unit the same way as the original.
 

jimmyjimmy19702010

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I bet the old setup with the passives will reach lower than the new setup.
The passives were there for one reason - to reinforce the lower bass frequencies. If you remove the passives, you will loose the deep bass. If you were to replace the passives
with 6.5 inch speakers, you may discover that you've actually boosted the mids. So you'll have 4 speakers with overlapping frequency outputs particularly in those mid frequencies.

That's cool though if your intention was to just make your Toshiba play louder.

The other issue is a lack of amplifier power. Toshiba designed the amp to drive 2 x 4.5 inch drivers. You're now asking a modestly powered amp to drive 2 x 4.5 inch and 2 x 6.5 inch drivers. You'll need 3 way crossovers to sort out the frequency issues for sure.

Have you thought of replicating the original setup with uprated passives and drivers? - now that could sound very nice indeed! :-)
 

Radio raheem

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Been there and tried this with several different set ups to no avail....belive me when i say these toshibas work best with there own drivers...good luck anyway dude
 

Reli

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You were probably going to Dynamat the interior anyway, but it would be interesting to learn how much of an improvement that makes before you do anything else. I bet it would remove some of the boxiness caused by thin plastic walls.

I have a similar system I need to mod. 3-piece with passive radiators. The walls are thin as hell, so Dynamat is an obvious improvement. I was also thinking about adding some fiberfill to deepen the bass, but I'm not sure if fiberfill makes sense for a passive system. Seems to me it might reduce the responsiveness of the passive radiator.

box2.jpg

box1.jpg
 

Barb Bush

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Rimmer36 said:
Been there and tried this with several different set ups to no avail....belive me when i say these toshibas work best with there own drivers...good luck anyway dude
Have you tried to use a larger woofer and smaller passive radiator? If so, how is the bass? Does it become muddy or have too much midbass?
 

JVC Floyd

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The radiators only job is to produce low bass that the main drivers cannot produce thus increasing the overall SPL of the system. The reason this is done Is to achieve the highest sensitivity and efficient use of amplifier power.
 

Radio raheem

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Barb Bush said:
Been there and tried this with several different set ups to no avail....belive me when i say these toshibas work best with there own drivers...good luck anyway dude
Have you tried to use a larger woofer and smaller passive radiator? If so, how is the bass? Does it become muddy or have too much midbass?
I tried several different main drivers and padding...I left the passives alone but I was not happy, you could get more bass etc but it just didn't work...same as with the Toshiba Hr-o1-753. the original are the best imho
 

Cpl-Chronic

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Thanks for the input peeps....All good points but I'm forging on to see if I can succeed. I'll post pics & videos soon... :-D

The main idea was to save the original woofers & passives to keep them in good shape while creating a 3-way speaker system with a deeper bass rolloff than the original. Yes, the original setup is hard to beat. It does sound very good overall...

Right now I'm working on the 2nd speaker box right now.... :-D

Cheers,
Cpl
 

Cpl-Chronic

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Barb Bush said:
Been there and tried this with several different set ups to no avail....belive me when i say these toshibas work best with there own drivers...good luck anyway dude...
Rimmer - Interesting that you also tried to MOD these speakers. I agree, the old setup is damn near impossible to match, as far as efficiency, sound & bottom end. The woofers I have are extremely well made units designed to hit 40Hz in a very small, sealed bookshelf box & have excellent low bass response. The Subs are well behaved & roll off well before the midrange area while The 4.5 Pioneers are not mid-range drivers. They are very good 'full-range' woofers that could do go down to about 80hz realistically & have very smooth low-mid to upper mid performance for use in a good small bookshelf system such as a 4.5" woofer & soft dome tweeter setup like the Realistic Minimus 7's that sounded so sweet back in the 80's but lacked that bottom octave punch...

So, hopefully, stuffing the Pioneers inside a Tupperware tub will isolate them from the sub-woofers & create a mid/mid-bass driver down to about 250Hz with an acoustic rolloff, maybe 6db & the subs take it from there to reach the bottom end down to 40Hz...I'm estimating off the cuff but you have to start somewhere when you experiment like this until you get an idea of what you're working with...

Rimmer36 said:
I tried several different main drivers and padding...I left the passives alone but I was not happy, you could get more bass etc but it just didn't work...same as with the Toshiba Hr-o1-753. the original are the best imho
That's why it failed...If you leave the passives in, they are tuned to the original Toshiba woofers & only work with them unless you get lucky & find another model with the same characteristics....With 2 woofers, the only thing they care about is having a good sealed or vented enclosure that enhances their performance. The subs are designed to hit 50Hz in a 0.16 cu ft enclosure so as long as the Pioneers behave well in a very small sealed enclosure, it's golden....should work...

We'll have to see....That's what I like about trying quirky ideas if it sounds good to my logical side...
 

Cpl-Chronic

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Reli said:
You were probably going to Dynamat the interior anyway, but it would be interesting to learn how much of an improvement that makes before you do anything else. I bet it would remove some of the boxiness caused by thin plastic walls.

I have a similar system I need to mod. 3-piece with passive radiators. The walls are thin as hell, so Dynamat is an obvious improvement. I was also thinking about adding some fiberfill to deepen the bass, but I'm not sure if fiberfill makes sense for a passive system. Seems to me it might reduce the responsiveness of the passive radiator.

box2.jpg

box1.jpg
Yup! It did improve things out of the gate, using Rattle Trap matting, same as Dynamat. The Toshiba boxes are very good actually at breaking up standing waves & the grid-like reinforcements on the back panel go a long way to remove that thin plastic box sound. Using fiber-fill or any kind of loose insulation/fill is exactly the wrong thing to do. If you have a passive radiator system, then there is no internal back-wave pressure to deal with. The idea of the insulation is to slow down the wave from back of the woofer's cone so it doesn't slap the back of the cabinet, sort of. The Passive works by reacting to the back-wave of the woofer so any kind of insualation added will affect the sound adversely because the system is now out of tune.

The Tosh skins are very good & the look was pretty lethal too but I want to save them in plastic so they don't rot or get worn out while creating my own bad-ass sound from those cabinets. It's fun to try different stuff to see if you can come up with something better or at least unique...

I always try to upgrade speakers & save the originals if I can. The Sharp 777 was garbage with the original speakers. That's how I got the bug to do this...
 

Cpl-Chronic

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Ok...had a few projects around the house to tend to before getting back to my tubbed out experiment but I did a few test runs with the first try at this....as you can see from the video, the Bass & Treble are a hair above '0' or 'FLAT' settings & the Exteneded Bass control is at '2' or a little below..

I think it sounds quite good & just as loud as the original speakers....I may have to open them up again & make a few adjustments but overall I'm happy with the sound...

BAM!!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIFVGmOiAtE

More to come. Stay tuned....

Cheers,
Cpl
 

Cpl-Chronic

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Ok... after listening to a few songs & putting it through it's paces, the left side does have a noise issue of some sort, guessing it's a leak somewhere around the Pioneer driver of the left cabinet. I can hear the noise coming primarily from the Pioneer woofer. I'll open it up & make some tweaks & add more dead-mat to the Pioneer enclosure I made out of food containers. I'll post a short Youtube vid & description soon...

Cheers,
Cpl :-D
 

Cpl-Chronic

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Ok....Update time...

I did some careful closeup listening with lots of bassy boomy tracks to track down the leaks & opened both cabinets up to apply deadmat around the circumference of all 4 woofers. I also noticed that the bottoms of each food container still had that plastic thump sound to them which had to be sorted out too so I added some blanket type insulation to the bottoms of the container enclosures to avoid noisy artifacts from the subs vibrating the containers. Finally, added 2 layers of deamat to the outside of the container walls to dampen internal ringing from the 4.5" woofers. Here's a short video to show what I did inside:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gkIfxDWif6Y

Both woofers are 4 OHM & wired in series for an 8 OHM load to the amp. The tweeters are stock original 4 OHM drivers in paralell with the series wired woofers & using the original capacitor crossovers. No crossovers are used on the woofers & operate as full range speakers.

And here is the final result of all my tinkering & work:

Line In DEMO:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CrXLyH5Y0_E


More videos to come...stay tuned.. :-D

Cpl
 
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