LOOKING FOR INFO - CRACKING THE 10 D-CELL BARRIER

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Cpl-Chronic

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May 14, 2012
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Heyya all, =)

What's crackin'?? Anyway, just wondering if any blasters from the early 80's cracked the 10-D-CELL barrier? My 777Z gives 18v when AC powered but only 15v from the DC jack or batteries. Is there any blaster that has 12 D-CELLS? That's 18v of juice & almost 10 amps peak draw, right?
 

Superduper

Member (SA)
Almost every boombox power supply with no load registers 18v and some even higher. But under load, the voltage quickly drops and could be lower than 15v. Boombox power supplies are not regulated so voltage is high with no load and low under heavy load. The max draw will always be based on available power. Check input power ratings and do your math. I think the 777 probably consumes about 60watts or so from the wall. If you figure 15v average, that comes to 4 amps.

The optional Sony FH-7 amp/battery module takes 12D cells.
 

Cpl-Chronic

Member (SA)
May 14, 2012
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Windsor, Ontario, CANADA
Superduper said:
Almost every boombox power supply with no load registers 18v and some even higher. But under load, the voltage quickly drops and could be lower than 15v. Boombox power supplies are not regulated so voltage is high with no load and low under heavy load. The max draw will always be based on available power. Check input power ratings and do your math. I think the 777 probably consumes about 60watts or so from the wall. If you figure 15v average, that comes to 4 amps.

The optional Sony FH-7 amp/battery module takes 12D cells.
Of course, you are correct sir. My point being that the AC circuit supplies a DC voltage of 18v While the most possible from the jack or batteries is 15v. They all go through the 2 pin connector to the rest of the blaster so there is a difference in power available to everything on the other side of that 2-pin DC power connector. No? Would the transformer be a limiting factor in how much power is available from that 18v rail? Is that where the 60w maximum rating comes from?

Do the facts you told me imply that battery power doesn't suffer the same droop in voltage that a transformer & rectifier circuit experiences? I wish I knew more.

I picture it as an 18v rail that, from what you say, droops due to poor regulation so when playing a tape deck with the speakers cranked, brings the voltage down to 15v on medium volume & bass cranked, or even 12v when a heavy bass song draws lots of amp power. Have both decks running for dubbing, it might even hit 10v on peaks?
 

Superduper

Member (SA)
You're not listening very well. I think you should consider attending some electronics courses, preferably not online, since you need handholding and a live person to ask questions to. I say this because rather than absorb the information, you have a tendency to want to challenge the information given. It's good to want to learn more about electronics but you should do it in a true educational forum (and I don't mean internet forums) so that you will learn the correct information rather than get information from a group where few of the members have formal instruction in the discipline. This is not a dig, it is a suggestion. But if you really want to get your information from internet forums, then don't get it here, go to AllAboutCircuits (and a few others) where many if not most of the members are professional electronics engineers and electricians that will give you the educational experience you want. Just be advised that you will be expected to do your own research as they are not there to conduct free electronics classes but will gladly answer specific questions. If you ask a question where the response is going to begin with...... "where do I begin...." you know you are in trouble. Nobody wants to waste time educating someone that just sits there and says give it to me because I'm too lazy to find this information myself.

As for the 777, there IS NO 18v rail. There is a 15v unregulated rail regardless of how the boombox is powered up. There are a few "regulated" internal rails but they are there to supply power to voltage sensitive circuits such as for the tuner, which due to precise circuit tuning, requires a stable supply. The AC P/S is not regulated but if it were, I suspect that it would be "regulated" at about 15volts. The expected "average" or normal voltage during AC usage will probably be around 15-16 volts anyhow. Forget the 18.1 volts no-load measurement, it's meaningless. And the AC input is not there for show... it is the transformer's input rating. Unity gain is the best you can hope for with respect to power and zero loss (or 100% efficiency) which we know isn't really possible, especially with unregulated linear supplies. So with that, the 61 watts (or whatever the back of your boombox case says) is the rated continous power consumption. That gives you 15v @ approx 4-amps. Higher current draw will result in a corresponding reduction in voltage = approx same "power."

One last thing.... please stop quoting text when you respond unless absolutely necessary or if you are responding to a particular point in which case, only quote the necessary applicable text. We here on this forum are not so stoopid that we don't know what you are responding to, especially if there's only 1 other post. Thanks.
 

Cpl-Chronic

Member (SA)
May 14, 2012
2,029
31
48
Windsor, Ontario, CANADA
Superduper said:
You're not listening very well. I think you should consider attending some electronics courses, preferably not online, since you need handholding and a live person to ask questions to. I say this because rather than absorb the information, you have a tendency to want to challenge the information given. It's good to want to learn more about electronics but you should do it in a true educational forum (and I don't mean internet forums) so that you will learn the correct information rather than get information from a group where few of the members have formal instruction in the discipline. This is not a dig, it is a suggestion. But if you really want to get your information from internet forums, then don't get it here, go to AllAboutCircuits (and a few others) where many if not most of the members are professional electronics engineers and electricians that will give you the educational experience you want. Just be advised that you will be expected to do your own research as they are not there to conduct free electronics classes but will gladly answer specific questions. If you ask a question where the response is going to begin with...... "where do I begin...." you know you are in trouble. Nobody wants to waste time educating someone that just sits there and says give it to me because I'm too lazy to find this information myself.

As for the 777, there IS NO 18v rail. There is a 15v unregulated rail regardless of how the boombox is powered up. There are a few "regulated" internal rails but they are there to supply power to voltage sensitive circuits such as for the tuner, which due to precise circuit tuning, requires a stable supply. The AC P/S is not regulated but if it were, I suspect that it would be "regulated" at about 15volts. The expected "average" or normal voltage during AC usage will probably be around 15-16 volts anyhow. Forget the 18.1 volts no-load measurement, it's meaningless. And the AC input is not there for show... it is the transformer's input rating. Unity gain is the best you can hope for with respect to power and zero loss (or 100% efficiency) which we know isn't really possible, especially with unregulated linear supplies. So with that, the 61 watts (or whatever the back of your boombox case says) is the rated continous power consumption. That gives you 15v @ approx 4-amps. Higher current draw will result in a corresponding reduction in voltage = approx same "power."

One last thing.... please stop quoting text when you respond unless absolutely necessary or if you are responding to a particular point in which case, only quote the necessary applicable text. We here on this forum are not so stoopid that we don't know what you are responding to, especially if there's only 1 other post. Thanks.
bye!
 

Cpl-Chronic

Member (SA)
May 14, 2012
2,029
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Windsor, Ontario, CANADA
stynger007 said:
Did I miss something here?? :huh: :lol: :-P

Hey CPL CHRONIC, was going to ask you what Sony that was in your avatar ,, but you said bye? :dog: ? :lol:

Anyone know what box that is, love the LED lites :yes:

That's my 777Z, actually. I'm not saying goodbye to the site. If you read the posts you can see who's being petty for yourselves. It's a no-barainer.
 

Line Out

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Jul 16, 2012
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60W power rating only tells the maximum power draw when connected to AC. Some boxes are even louder on batteries because of steadier voltage. Those have bad quality or not beefy enough transformer, that wont give enough current.

A quick way to categorize theoretical amplifier power out:

GF-777 has 60W power rating.

60W / 2 = 30W
Analog power amplifier usually has its efficiency at around 50%, so thats 30W, half of 60W.

0,2A x 15V = 3W
A cassette deck motor current draw is around 0,1A (amperes) per motor. GF-777 has 2 motors, thats 0,2A. That multiplied by the voltage (15V), we'll have the power draw (watts).

30W - 3W = 27W
Reduce the power draw of cassette deck motors from the total power rating.

27 W / 4 = 6,75W
27W divided to four speakers = 4 x 6,75W.

This result is very close to the real power output. Sharp specifies the GF-777 power out to 4 x 8W @ 10%THD. So this can give us even more realistic (lower THD) output power values.

I don't know if every motor takes 0,1A, could be much less, or even more. That value is just a quick check from some pdf of Mabuchi brushless motor series, used also in cassette decks.
 

Line Out

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Jul 16, 2012
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Of course. But that goes so deep... As I said, a quick way.

I am not familiar of the consumption/efficiency of those components you mentioned. Learning as I go... I do have 3 years of electronics education, though it was very poorly implemented from both school and me.
 
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